it's over....

[JamesB]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/...ain/index.html

i'm gonna bury a hole and live there for the next 4 years....

[Catdaddy]

It kind of reminds me of the Phantasm movie series that always had a cliffhanger ending. In the immortal words of the Tall Man:

"It's never.... over!"

[Shane R. Monroe]

Life ... sucks.

[JamesB]

Life ... sucks.

and you know what else sucks? there was no screw up in the voting process (like what happened in florida). the majority of americans actually VOTED for him.

[Shane R. Monroe]

I'm incredibly displeased. We've turn the sacred privilege of voting in our president into nothing more than SUV ownership. Thanks to everyone shoving uninformed, misinformed, and "I'm voting the way my friends are because I don't know anything" people to the polls, we've managed to turn a nation of people who don't care NOT voting - to people who don't care ACTUALLY voting.

I respect the people that DIDN'T go to the polls without having a clear, informed concept of what's going on.

Not voting can't hurt anyone. Voting in the wrong person can affect the world. That's my feeling on the matter.

And yes - I've been depressed most of the day.

[Demolition Man]

I know how you feel Shane. I can't tell you how many people at my work that voted for Bush just becuase "he's doing a good job" yet I ask them how and all I get it "well.. well... I'll have to get back to you on that."

I'm not afraid of saying that I voted for John Kerry. I didn't make my judgement based off of the commercials like my mother did. I watched the debates, I payed good attention to everything and I felt overall that John Kerry had a better idea overall for what direction he wanted to take the country in. Yet sadly a few million Bush "supporters" (or sheeple) felt that Bush is better suited to run our country for the next four years.

Sad day indeed.

[JamesB]

We've turn the sacred privilege of voting in our president into nothing more than SUV ownership. Thanks to everyone shoving uninformed, misinformed, and "I'm voting the way my friends are because I don't know anything" people to the polls, we've managed to turn a nation of people who don't care NOT voting - to people who don't care ACTUALLY voting.

that's EXACTLY how i fell about this so called election. people carelessly voting for canidates because either because their friends told them to or thet'ye just ****ing clueless. if i had been living under a rock over the last 4 years and didn't know wtf was going on i would've NEVER voted at all rather than choosing the wrong guy for the job.

like Shane said, voting has become just "another fad" like the SUVs....

[Catdaddy]

I'm incredibly displeased. We've turn the sacred privilege of voting in our president into nothing more than SUV ownership. Thanks to everyone shoving uninformed, misinformed, and "I'm voting the way my friends are because I don't know anything" people to the polls, we've managed to turn a nation of people who don't care NOT voting - to people who don't care ACTUALLY voting.

The precinct that I voted at (Franklin county) here in Ohio had an average wait time of 2.5 hours. I stood in line for 3 waiting to cast my vote (although I heard some places had it worse). I couldn't tell you how many people I saw who came up, took one look at the line and then walked away. If you're not that dedicated or believe in your candidate that much then maybe you SHOULD stay home.

I also encountered a lot of this:

"Well, since I'm voting for Bush and you're voting for Kerry we may as well stay home".

or

"The accounting dept. has more people voting for Bush than the IT dept. has people voting for Kerry so we'll just cancel your vote out."

If you voted for what you truly believed in then nobody has the right to say ****! to you. But if you were one of the many (and I seen a bunch of them in line) who stood there and just punched buttons in the voting booth based on a slip of paper given to you by your church, then all I can say is "Shame on ya'".

[Mogwa]

Why? Because very few people take the time to study history and apply the lessons learned. It amuses me to no end to hear people who never heard of fractional reserve banking theory and cyclic supply dynamics pontificate on government economic policy. The same model holds true on any other subject you might care to name. Rather than posit well researched hypotheses, most of us want to tell the world what we FEEL about any given controversial subject, whether it's abortion or state sanctioned gay marriage. With all due respect, your feelings don't amount to bullspit. Sure, you can espouse them to your heart's content, but don't expect me to respect those opinions as valid statements of fact. Emotional diatribes only make things worse. That's why you'll hear so many "true believers" resort to name calling. Those who disagree with their political views are described as religious fanatics, idiots, zealots, and the like.
It's just that sort of repulsive nonsense that gave us such wonderful moments in human history as the Holocaust and Rawanda. We've never experinced tragedies like that her in America, but it's never too late to catch up. Given the current trends I see in this country demonstrated by a wiilingly ignorant population, I'm certain that interesting times are just around the corner.

[Shane R. Monroe]

You don't have to be an economics historian to understand how to lose $80B in less than a year. You don't have to be a master mechanic to know something is wrong with your car.

The point is: those of us that have followed the issues ... took TIME AWAY FROM WATCHING AMERICA'S TOP MODEL AND THE SWAN to learn about the current issues that plague our country and its administration gives us one HELLUVA bigger foot to stand on and bitch about than people that watch life go idly by and voice their 'options' on items of no bearing to themselves.

This is very simple - you don't have to wax intellectual to get a grip on this. Let me set it up for you...

Your car is broke down. You have two choices for repairs. You can take it to someone who tinkers in their spare time, never worked on your make and model, doesn't keep up with modern electronics in cars, etc. OR .. you could take it to the dealer who specializes in your EXACT vehicle. Where is the trust? Who would YOU rely on to make that decision? Let's take it another step ...

Your kid is dying. Brain tumor. Medical insurance is picking up the tab - so cost isn't the issue. You can have 20 year brain surgeon Dr. Smith work on your child or ... you can get the orderly that sits in and sometimes watches a 'little something' about brain surgery operate on her. This is a NO BRAINER here (no pun intended).

What we are doing is trusting THE REPRESENTATION OF OUR COUNTRY to 'orderlies that occassionally overhear political discussions' who have little to no intellectual thought process over and above programming their Tivo to record Queer Eye for the Straight Guy. THAT is my point. You can say "No one has a valid argument - so why argue". I dare say there ain't a swingin' dick on this forum that knows What's Really Going On(tm) - myself included. But, I spend a dozen hours a week following the issues - looking at them from all sides - TRYING TO MAKE MYSELF INFORMED so that I CAN cast a ballot in at least SOMEWHAT the right direction. I'm doing 100x more than "Joe Q. Public" to be a responsible American. Unfortunately - the RESPONSIBLE American is almost a misnomer now.

Mogwa - what makes you an expert? Truly, if you know something we don't - then SHARE.

Fact is - there ARE some black and whites out there. There ARE issues that are VALID to debate upon that do not require conjecture. Do I have the right to kill you while you sleep? Pretty black and white, right? Do I have the RIGHT to come on to your land and steal what is yours? Black and white. Does the USA have a RIGHT to invade a country for no valid reason and sacrifice 1000+ soldiers for a war even the people we're liberating don't even want? That's pretty black and white.

Sure, there are topics of MORAL issue. However, our government isn't there to stop or control these. Our government was CREATED to separate Church and State for these VERY reasons; religion is NEVER black and white - and they knew there could never be a legitimate governing body that could control these issues. Abortion, stem cells, gay marriage ... these are issues the government simply doesn't have a leg to stand on. Abortion is a matter of symantecs... when is a baby a baby? Stem Cells follow suit on that. Gay marriage is a CLEAR violation of separation of church and state; since our president has told us Jesus told him its wrong.

The problem we have with this country is mainly the blur between VALUES and RELIGION. People don't believe you can have one without the other. And that blurry line is what won Bush this election IMHO. I can believe in the institute of marriage while not believing in God, for example. I can teach my child not to steal, like, and cheat - not because Jesus doesn't like it - but because you wouldn't want someone to steal from you, lie to you, or cheat you - so you do the same.

You should be DAMN HAPPY there are passionate filled people WILLING to step forward and debate and discuss these issues. Without us, life would be worse than it already is.

One thing we can agree on - there are interesting times ahead. And they are going to be unpleasant wake up calls. But like the child that doesn't understand the word NO until its backed up with blisters on a burned hand from a hot stove - the point will get made.

There is one